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Author Topic: What Bantam AA Teams for 2019-2020?  (Read 167732 times)

notTHATdad

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Re: What Bantam AA Teams for 2019-2020?
« Reply #45 on: September 04, 2019, 06:22:27 PM »
Last I checked...


2 California 15AAA teams made it to nationals last year right? (Ducks and Sharks)

There are 1200 AA teams nationally, and 110 AAA teams, or about 10-1
We have 3 AAA teams for about 18 AA teams. The ratio is even higher.


Doesn't sound that "watered down" to me.
« Last Edit: September 04, 2019, 06:42:11 PM by notTHATdad »

Hockey05

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Re: What Bantam AA Teams for 2019-2020?
« Reply #46 on: September 05, 2019, 08:10:22 AM »



Here are the registration statistics for USA Hockey:

https://cdn1.sportngin.com/attachments/document/2210-1687681/2018-19_Final_Registration_Report.pdf?_ga=2.28920952.576185148.1567648672-1897795979.1551128881


It isn't MN or NY but there are a lot of players out here.  I think most parents and players know the dream, whatever it may be, is not going to happen.  They just want to keep playing competitively and they don't view what is out here as good enough. 

Strawman

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Re: What Bantam AA Teams for 2019-2020?
« Reply #47 on: September 05, 2019, 09:46:10 AM »
Looking on the bright side, CAHA could not possibly do a better job of forcing California's best players to pursue opportunities outside the state at an early age.

PutYourFootOnTheGas

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Re: What Bantam AA Teams for 2019-2020?
« Reply #48 on: September 05, 2019, 10:48:49 AM »



Here are the registration statistics for USA Hockey:

https://cdn1.sportngin.com/attachments/document/2210-1687681/2018-19_Final_Registration_Report.pdf?_ga=2.28920952.576185148.1567648672-1897795979.1551128881


It isn't MN or NY but there are a lot of players out here.  I think most parents and players know the dream, whatever it may be, is not going to happen.  They just want to keep playing competitively and they don't view what is out here as good enough. 


We have beaten this subject to death (I have certainly contributed). The registration numbers do provide a good way to compare CA vs. the rest of the country however.


I did quick comparison of # of total registered players (boys only) for the 13-14 and 15-16 in IL, MI, CA, MA, NY and CO as compared to the # of AAA players in these respective states.


To my surprise, IL actually has fewer boys (as a %) playing at AAA compared to the total # of registered players. CA has the next lowest percentage. NY had the highest % of AAA players to total registered players at 13-14 and 2nd highest at 15-16.


The differences are not real big across the board though so I'm not sure exactly what, "they don't view what is out here is good enough" means. If CA added one more AAA team in SoCal at each level (13AAA, 14AAA, 15AAA, 16AAA) we'd fall right in the middle of the aforementioned states at the Bantam level. Add one in SoCal and one in NorCal at each level and we'd be right behind NY with the highest %. I get the sense that still would not make the loudest critics happy.


One could also argue that if you look closer at the states with the highest % of AAA players to total registered players, the AAA teams near the bottom of the rankings would be mid pack AA teams in their state (using My Hockey Rankings). Are they misplaced?? Does having them playing AAA help or hurt the age group?

Landshark

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Re: What Bantam AA Teams for 2019-2020?
« Reply #49 on: September 05, 2019, 11:41:06 AM »
I find the aaa v aa debate to be a bit beside the point. We don’t need a single rule change to revive hockey in this state. We need an innovator.  We have managers who do a fine job, but imagine a CAHA that makes people value their child’s experience in CA.


Caha sponsors a tournament at every age level at the end of the year where the top two aa teams are invited to play the aaa teams.


Scaha could do the same in the lower levels.


The website could have picture cards for each player. The players stats could be managed and Parents could upload highlight plays.


Each team could be loaned one of the sensor packages that are coming out for coaches. It tracks the speed and activity of each player for one game. The stats could be incorporated in the player card to promote players beyond our borders.


California has some of the deepest resources in the country. Why don’t we have a Apple sponsored spring team that costs nothing and is open only to California players who want to test some of the best tournaments back east in the off season.


I know that it’s just me talking(I’d rather have someone engaging like Keanu Reeves lead the charge. Everyone listens to Keanu Reeves). I don’t expect a revolution,  We need leadership that can put new ideas into motion and draw kids into the sport and take them to the top of the sport.
« Last Edit: September 05, 2019, 12:28:13 PM by Landshark »

Fowlmood

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Re: What Bantam AA Teams for 2019-2020?
« Reply #50 on: September 05, 2019, 01:33:18 PM »
"in one post your complaining that there are AA teams that don't belong, then you want more AAA teams? If your kid didn't make it this year, he'll have another chance next year. AAA was watered down a few years ago and everyone complained. Now everyone complains because they can't get little Johnny his extra letter."

Hey Area, I never made that complaint.  I would never say that.  I don't see myself as one who would limit those opportunities for AA teams that want to play in the division of their choice.  I'm not from Vacaville. 

On the other point.  My son didn't tryout for AAA, so he is unaffected.  The exodus from CA is alarming.  CAHA needs to rethink their strategy to one that is perhaps less self serving.  I am not exactly sure what their motivation is.  Open for discussion, I suppose.  There just seems to be far too many players leaving CA.  So not good for the health of local competition.  [/font]
« Last Edit: September 05, 2019, 01:35:03 PM by Fowlmood »

Strawman

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Re: What Bantam AA Teams for 2019-2020?
« Reply #51 on: September 05, 2019, 02:40:53 PM »



Here are the registration statistics for USA Hockey:

https://cdn1.sportngin.com/attachments/document/2210-1687681/2018-19_Final_Registration_Report.pdf?_ga=2.28920952.576185148.1567648672-1897795979.1551128881


It isn't MN or NY but there are a lot of players out here.  I think most parents and players know the dream, whatever it may be, is not going to happen.  They just want to keep playing competitively and they don't view what is out here as good enough. 


We have beaten this subject to death (I have certainly contributed). The registration numbers do provide a good way to compare CA vs. the rest of the country however.


I did quick comparison of # of total registered players (boys only) for the 13-14 and 15-16 in IL, MI, CA, MA, NY and CO as compared to the # of AAA players in these respective states.


To my surprise, IL actually has fewer boys (as a %) playing at AAA compared to the total # of registered players. CA has the next lowest percentage. NY had the highest % of AAA players to total registered players at 13-14 and 2nd highest at 15-16.


The differences are not real big across the board though so I'm not sure exactly what, "they don't view what is out here is good enough" means. If CA added one more AAA team in SoCal at each level (13AAA, 14AAA, 15AAA, 16AAA) we'd fall right in the middle of the aforementioned states at the Bantam level. Add one in SoCal and one in NorCal at each level and we'd be right behind NY with the highest %. I get the sense that still would not make the loudest critics happy.


One could also argue that if you look closer at the states with the highest % of AAA players to total registered players, the AAA teams near the bottom of the rankings would be mid pack AA teams in their state (using My Hockey Rankings). Are they misplaced?? Does having them playing AAA help or hurt the age group?


Hard to make meaningful comparisons between CA and places like IL and NY in my opinion.  When the Ducks and Kings AAA teams are forced to play each other a dozen times every season at every age level, and fly cross-country every two or three weeks find someone else to play, we create an almost uniquely impossible environment for the game for flourish.

PutYourFootOnTheGas

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Re: What Bantam AA Teams for 2019-2020?
« Reply #52 on: September 05, 2019, 03:43:35 PM »



Here are the registration statistics for USA Hockey:

https://cdn1.sportngin.com/attachments/document/2210-1687681/2018-19_Final_Registration_Report.pdf?_ga=2.28920952.576185148.1567648672-1897795979.1551128881


It isn't MN or NY but there are a lot of players out here.  I think most parents and players know the dream, whatever it may be, is not going to happen.  They just want to keep playing competitively and they don't view what is out here as good enough. 


We have beaten this subject to death (I have certainly contributed). The registration numbers do provide a good way to compare CA vs. the rest of the country however.


I did quick comparison of # of total registered players (boys only) for the 13-14 and 15-16 in IL, MI, CA, MA, NY and CO as compared to the # of AAA players in these respective states.


To my surprise, IL actually has fewer boys (as a %) playing at AAA compared to the total # of registered players. CA has the next lowest percentage. NY had the highest % of AAA players to total registered players at 13-14 and 2nd highest at 15-16.


The differences are not real big across the board though so I'm not sure exactly what, "they don't view what is out here is good enough" means. If CA added one more AAA team in SoCal at each level (13AAA, 14AAA, 15AAA, 16AAA) we'd fall right in the middle of the aforementioned states at the Bantam level. Add one in SoCal and one in NorCal at each level and we'd be right behind NY with the highest %. I get the sense that still would not make the loudest critics happy.


One could also argue that if you look closer at the states with the highest % of AAA players to total registered players, the AAA teams near the bottom of the rankings would be mid pack AA teams in their state (using My Hockey Rankings). Are they misplaced?? Does having them playing AAA help or hurt the age group?


Hard to make meaningful comparisons between CA and places like IL and NY in my opinion.  When the Ducks and Kings AAA teams are forced to play each other a dozen times every season at every age level, and fly cross-country every two or three weeks find someone else to play, we create an almost uniquely impossible environment for the game for flourish.


I agree. Let's face it. Hockey in California is a fringe sport. The relatively low number of participants plus the large geographical layout, makes it as you say, "uniquely impossible environment for the game to flourish." These factors make it extremely hard for CAHA to do anything meaningful about. The way the argument goes for many is that CAHA is to blame which is crazy in my opinion. Are they perfect. . . .not even close. They have not set up the current system much different than any other state though which is what I was trying to show by analyzing the registration #s.


My son has played AAA for years. I knew the large amount of travel was part of the deal. He and the family have loved every moment of it. We've visited cities we likely never would have without the sport. I'd personally take that any day over the convenience of playing more locally in a watered down version of play or blasting the hell out of teams that have no business fielding AAA teams just so there are more for the division.


I don't know what is the best solution. I'm open to debating new approaches but for the most part, people just come on here and complain. Is there another state using a better approach? If so, where and what do they do that could be implemented feasibly in CA?




InDZone

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Re: What Bantam AA Teams for 2019-2020?
« Reply #53 on: September 05, 2019, 04:44:45 PM »
I would like to see more opportunities for AAA besides the kings, ducks, and sharks.
in one post your complaining that there are AA teams that don't belong, then you want more AAA teams? If your kid didn't make it this year, he'll have another chance next year. AAA was watered down a few years ago and everyone complained. Now everyone complains because they can't get little Johnny his extra letter.


Several seem to say that AAA is "watered" down...my question is in comparison to who? The same could be said about AA...it's watered down and the kids that are moving to AAA don't find the competition so all they have to resort to is AAA.


Would be nice if there were other AAA SoCal teams besides the three that exist.

notTHATdad

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Re: What Bantam AA Teams for 2019-2020?
« Reply #54 on: September 05, 2019, 05:39:15 PM »
One of the posters above almost hit what is probably our best hope. We need a few more western states to get serious about AAA. I am hoping that the Jr Knights will turn AAA some day, and a similar team in Seattle once they have their NHL franchise running will do it. The NHL clubs all want to have feeder systems, if for no other reason than you end up with a lot of well heeled ex hockey players in an area when you have an NHL club.


Once we have a couple more AAA clubs on the coast, we will have the possibility of a nice little AAA western circuit and the travel costs will come down for everyone. CAHA will have nothing to do with that.


Just in time for my kids to all have finished playing  >:(


As for the 'great bleed' that everyone seems to see of kids going to east coast schools, I'm sorry, but I don't see it as a crisis. It happens everywhere. My nephew did it... from Ontario. When your kid is good enough, regardless of where you play, at some point that becomes a possibility that you have to look at. We did, and decided our kid was too young to move away. I know the Bantam Major Jr Sharks lost 1 to prep school this year. Not sure what happened with the Kings or Ducks but 'other' issues will certainly have contributed to the Kings. When presented with choices, sometime people choose to take a chance.




Knuckle Puck

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Re: What Bantam AA Teams for 2019-2020?
« Reply #55 on: September 06, 2019, 10:10:02 AM »
aaa post-peewee ultimately is going to be dominated by the academy model. that's what families want -- a coordinated academic/hockey program that provides more time on the ice, reduced travel, less missed class time, decent to excellent academics all at a manageable cost. the academies/preps already are taking over in the northeast and western canada, and making inroads in the midwest.

an example of what this ultimately could look like is the csshl in western canada. http://www.csshl.ca/leagues/custom_page.cfm?clientid=4542&leagueid=15269&pageid=17663. its a combo of historically strong private/boarding schools (saints, shawnigan), plus hockey academies that send their kids to accomodating private schools located close to rinks (oha, west van, bwc). the 12 to 15 teams per age division play each other and very rarely travel back east. very successful -- roughly half of the kids selected in the whl bantam draft now come from these schools, and they feed a ton of kids into the bchl (the #2 path to ncaa d1 after ushl. kids "get seen", get great hockey development, decent to great academics (depending on the school), with an all-in cost similar to an la private school education. 

its only a matter of time until this comes to socal. i know parent groups that have investigated doing it themselves.  kings and ducks ought to take the lead, as they are parts of billion dollar organizations that have the resources to pull this off.  until then, we will continue to see a parade of kids leave to join programs like this in other places.
« Last Edit: September 06, 2019, 01:31:09 PM by Knuckle Puck »

TheFourthA

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Re: What Bantam AA Teams for 2019-2020?
« Reply #56 on: September 06, 2019, 10:35:13 AM »
There are at least three hockey academies that opened in Orange County this season. 

Deuce

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Re: What Bantam AA Teams for 2019-2020?
« Reply #57 on: September 06, 2019, 10:47:19 AM »
There are at least three hockey academies that opened in Orange County this season. 


Which 3? I know of KHS Academy and Optimum Hockey Academy. What's the 3rd one?

TheFourthA

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Re: What Bantam AA Teams for 2019-2020?
« Reply #58 on: September 06, 2019, 11:13:51 AM »
I believe there is one called West Coast, also out of
The Great Park...

Knuckle Puck

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Re: What Bantam AA Teams for 2019-2020?
« Reply #59 on: September 06, 2019, 11:47:02 AM »
the academies that succeed will need to offer real academics, teachers and facilities (classrooms, science labs, etc.), and a social component (interactions with non-hockey kids, incl. girls).  "academics" of 3 hours a day at a computer in a windowless room at the rink is bullshit. a partnership between great park ice and the nearby and new portola high could be interesting.
« Last Edit: September 06, 2019, 12:22:58 PM by Knuckle Puck »