This Community is For Sale - For more information contact: admin@calhockey.com

Author Topic: What Bantam AA Teams for 2019-2020?  (Read 167721 times)

JackBender

  • Peewee
  • ***
  • Posts: 188
  • LR Justice +49/-20
    • Tom's Chuckle Barn
Re: What Bantam AA Teams for 2019-2020?
« Reply #75 on: September 11, 2019, 09:13:01 AM »
DING!  DING!  DING!

Icadad has hit the nail on the head:

I do blame them (CAHA) for losing sight of the fact that they are administrators for a league, and not evaluators of competitive competency.

Nicely stated, sir.  Agree 100%.  But just so we have all the ugly facts, let's remember that hundreds of families were FORCED by this governing body of administrators to travel to San Jose (the hockey minority market), which meant more than a third of these families had to drive or fly and stay at a hotel spending hundreds of dollars, if not thousands.  Great.  So what were the results of this manufactured Labor Day money grab quasi-tourney of 4 runtime games?   Three of the four divisions are not flighted. Um, excuse me?  Are you serious?  You idiots dragged us up to that suburb-gone-wild and then you don't even flight three of the four divisions?  Are you fucking nuts?  Congrats, CAHA, you've earned your 1st F*CK CAHA.

Let's continue, though. Of the one division that did get flighted (Bantam), I'm sure CAHA got that correct, right?  I'm sure that split was very obvious, right?  Nope.  Completely fucked that one too.   

Now, all season, we have to stare at the bullshit Bantam flighting breakdown that is a glaring reminder of CAHA's consistent bias, vague policies, and shady underhandedness.  Oh, and instead of making it a 10/10 split, which is logical, the split is 9/11?!  I mean, come on, boys.  It's like you're punishing yourselves now. 

But then the split was probably obvious, right?  It's was totally clear to everyone, right?  Nope.  Not at all.  CAHA just can't help from doing everything ass backwards and putting their hypocrisy on center stage with bright lights and glitter.   

Let's take a look.  And upon quick analysis of those 9 teams put into Flight 1, 4 teams (Bears(2), Flyers, GSE(1), and GSE(2)) had a WORSE showing at the Evaluation Weekend than the Wave. But don't believe me, let's look at the games and stats:

BEARS(2)
Bears(2) 2 Kings(2) 1
Bears(2) 2 Wave 2
Bears(2) 0 Ducks(1) 2
Bears(2) 0 Kings(1) 1
RECORD 1-2-1 (4 GF/6 GA)
Note: They lost 2 games to Flight 1 teams, tied a Flight 2 team, and beat a Flight 2 team.

FLYERS
Flyers 3 Ice Dogs 7
Flyers 0 Bears(1) 10
Flyers 7 GSE(2) 2
Flyers 3 Gulls(1) 0
RECORD 2-2 (13 GF/19 GA)
Note: They lost 2 games badly to Flight 1 teams, beat a weak Flight 1 team, and beat a bad Flight 2 team.

GSE(1)
GSE(1) 4 OCHC 2
GSE(1) 2 Blackhawks 2
GSE(1) 0 Saints 3
GSE(1) 5 Reign(1) 0
RECORD 2-1-1 (11GF/7 GA)
Note: They lost the lone Flight 1 team they faced, beat two Flight 2 teams, and tied a bad Flight 2 team.

GSE(2)
GSE(2) 4 Gulls(1) 3
GSE(2) 10 Ducks(2) 1
GSE(2) 1 Bears(1) 9
GSE(2) 2 Flyers 7
RECORD 2-2 (17 GF/20 GA)
Note: They lost badly to the two Flight 1 teams they faced and beat two bad Flight 2 teams, and only one convincingly.

Wave
Wave 1 Condors 0
Wave 2 Bears(2) 2
Wave 0 Gulls(2) 1
Wave 2 Ice Dogs 0
RECORD 2-1-1 (5 GF/3 GA)
Note: They beat a top Flight 1 team, tied a Flight 1 team, beat a Flight 2 team, and lost to a Flight 2 team (arguably the best remaining Flight 2 team).

So, of course, the logical result is that the Wave doesn't belong and it's better to go with a 9/11 split than a 10/10 split.  What?!?  Congrats, CAHA!  You have earned your 2nd F*CK CAHA! 

But let's be fair, let's look at who exactly evaluated these games.  Certainly these people were unbiased experts with full knowledge of the teams and the divisions, right?  I'm sure their sole focus was to get it right, right?  That CAHA had done their job and found the people who can break this division in half in the fairest and most honest way, right?  No.  Of course not. 

The evaluators were coaches from other divisions who learned as they arrived for the weekend that they were evaluating games.  Oh, and I'm sure they weren't distracted by their own games, players or parents, right?  Or influenced by their club's needs and desires (hello GSE!!!), right?  Good lord, CAHA.  Another well thought out, smooth-as-grease idea. 

Congrats, you've quickly earned your 3rd and final F*CK CAHA!

As objectively proven over and over again on this forum, CAHA stinks from the top down.  It starts with the #1 Boob himself President Tom Hancock and his merry Board of Dunderheads.  These people have spent a lifetime overreaching, enforcing biases, favoring friends, repaying grudges, and undermining the purity of the sport for their own financial and political gain.  It's wrong.  It's grotesque.  And with every opportunity this group has to be a mature, measured, logical, fair governing body... they do the opposite.   

It's sad.  And lame.  And nothing this group at CAHA does anymore is surprising.

P.S. After I mined the CAHA minutes to learn the story behind the AAA consolidation and power grab, CAHA stopped posting the minutes.  Nice one, boys.  Way to keep it honest.
I'm your Huckleberry

Hockey05

  • Midget
  • ****
  • Posts: 309
  • LR Justice +59/-33
Re: What Bantam AA Teams for 2019-2020?
« Reply #76 on: September 11, 2019, 09:30:23 AM »
It seems someone chose to remove my post from yesterday.  Hmmm,  :o .


Does anyone know if there is any update regarding this lawsuit:


https://www.chicagobusiness.com/news/hockeys-surge-popularity-pushes-sports-gatekeepers-court


CAHA will keep doing this crap until parents and families collectively say, enough!

keepdrinkinthekoolaid

  • Squirt
  • **
  • Posts: 85
  • LR Justice +16/-3
Re: What Bantam AA Teams for 2019-2020?
« Reply #77 on: September 11, 2019, 02:06:31 PM »

Congrats, CAHA, you've earned your 1st F*CK CAHA.


So, of course, the logical result is that the Wave doesn't belong and it's better to go with a 9/11 split than a 10/10 split.  What?!?  Congrats, CAHA!  You have earned your 2nd F*CK CAHA! 

unbiased experts? No.  Of course not. 

The evaluator's were coaches from other divisions who learned as they arrived for the weekend that they were evaluating games.  Good lord, CAHA.  Another well thought out, smooth-as-grease idea.  Congrats, you've quickly earned your 3rd and final F*CK CAHA!

As objectively proven over and over again on this forum, CAHA stinks from the top down.  It starts with the #1 Boob himself President Tom Hancock and his merry Board of Dunderheads.

P.S. After I mined the CAHA minutes to learn the story behind the AAA consolidation and power grab, CAHA stopped posting the minutes.  Nice one, boys.  Way to keep it honest.

(deleted some JackBender comments quoted above, solely to save space)
Jack Bender,

IMO, you are being much to nice.  Can see at least 2 or 3 more F*ck CAHAs just in your words above.

What about possible grudge and bias?  Didn't the CA Wave have to play a mandatory play-in game last year?  Making parents and families incur incredible expense, as they were out of country.  My understanding is there was no flexibility, 100% mandatory game on that date and time, true?

Is it possible this year, "powers that be" are making the Wave organization "pay"?
« Last Edit: September 11, 2019, 02:10:34 PM by keepdrinkinthekoolaid »

Fowlmood

  • Squirt
  • **
  • Posts: 90
  • LR Justice +9/-34
Re: What Bantam AA Teams for 2019-2020?
« Reply #78 on: September 11, 2019, 03:55:45 PM »
Rhetorical question, right?  How about the homer refs of CAHA?  The minions of the CAHA board? With agenda. 

Bear71

  • Peewee
  • ***
  • Posts: 130
  • LR Justice +34/-9
Re: What Bantam AA Teams for 2019-2020?
« Reply #79 on: September 11, 2019, 04:08:36 PM »
For those interested, there is a CAHA Board Meeting scheduled for 9/21 in El Segundo.  ;)

JackBender

  • Peewee
  • ***
  • Posts: 188
  • LR Justice +49/-20
    • Tom's Chuckle Barn
Re: What Bantam AA Teams for 2019-2020?
« Reply #80 on: September 11, 2019, 04:46:38 PM »
Hmm... does GrubHub deliver flaming bags of shit? 


« Last Edit: September 11, 2019, 05:26:10 PM by JackBender »
I'm your Huckleberry

Bear71

  • Peewee
  • ***
  • Posts: 130
  • LR Justice +34/-9
Re: What Bantam AA Teams for 2019-2020?
« Reply #81 on: September 11, 2019, 05:23:36 PM »
Hmm... does GrubHub deliver slamming bags of shit?


No, I think McDonald's uses Uber Eats.

Landshark

  • Peewee
  • ***
  • Posts: 238
  • LR Justice +77/-47
Re: What Bantam AA Teams for 2019-2020?
« Reply #82 on: September 11, 2019, 07:27:45 PM »
I actually thought the wave got hosed until I read your argument. You actually pushed me over to the other side. 


By your own reasoning, Bears 2 are not a solid flight one team. Wave tied them.


The gulls you call a flight two team to undermine the flyers. Bears 2 lost to them 0-5. Wave tied the team that lost to a middle flight two team by five goals. Your case is partially correct, but by dragging down other teams that you need to build yourself up, I think you inadvertently undercut your own argument.

GSEs were not superpowers but they looked good in the games I saw.
 
And if number of shots is a big deal for the Condors who played lower teams you’d better find a way to level that for anyone who played the saints or big Bears.

I get that it pissed you off, but pissing on the system is better than pissing on the kids that you think don’t deserve to be  where they are.  They do. And if they don’t, the wave has no case at all.
« Last Edit: September 11, 2019, 07:32:17 PM by Landshark »

JackBender

  • Peewee
  • ***
  • Posts: 188
  • LR Justice +49/-20
    • Tom's Chuckle Barn
Re: What Bantam AA Teams for 2019-2020?
« Reply #83 on: September 11, 2019, 08:05:34 PM »
I don't have an argument, I just presented the facts.


Wave also beat Bears(2) 4-1 before the weekend.


And you don't mention the Ice Dogs win, the #3 team in the State. Bears(2) played the Ice Dogs before the weekend, losing 8-1. Flyers lost to the Ice Dogs 7-3. The Wave beat the Ice Dogs 2-0. 


Those are simply facts. Draw your own conclusion.


Between the Flyers, Bears(2), and both GSE teams, the Wave was the ONLY team to beat a Flight 1 team. And they also tied one. Again, those are the facts.  Yet, CAHA put them at Flight 2, saying that they are not good enough to be in Flight 1... even though they were the only team to beat a Flight 1 team. To add insult to injury, they left the 10th Flight 1 spot open.


Still uncertain if the Wave got hosed?
« Last Edit: September 11, 2019, 08:18:48 PM by JackBender »
I'm your Huckleberry

4minuteminor

  • Squirt
  • **
  • Posts: 82
  • LR Justice +9/-115
Re: What Bantam AA Teams for 2019-2020?
« Reply #84 on: September 11, 2019, 08:54:53 PM »
To add to the mix: Wave tied OC this weekend 4 all. How does that add to the equation?

JackBender

  • Peewee
  • ***
  • Posts: 188
  • LR Justice +49/-20
    • Tom's Chuckle Barn
Re: What Bantam AA Teams for 2019-2020?
« Reply #85 on: September 11, 2019, 09:07:27 PM »
Irrelevant. It wasn't part of the evaluation.


Bears(2) also lost 5-0 to Gulls(1) this weekend. If anything, it only proves that AA is a two team race. Every other team is wildly inconsistent. But based on the unbiased numbers, if those other teams are Flight 1, then so are the Wave. 


Unless, you know, you're CAHA and logic and fairness is not part of the evaluation process.
« Last Edit: September 11, 2019, 09:08:53 PM by JackBender »
I'm your Huckleberry

lcadad

  • AHL
  • *****
  • Posts: 540
  • LR Justice +151/-121
Re: What Bantam AA Teams for 2019-2020?
« Reply #86 on: September 11, 2019, 09:21:37 PM »
No I think the Wave got hosed, but the point is that it's a systemic problem and not one of evaluation and some other team taking the Wave's spot.  I personally felt the Wave deserved a Flight1 slot this season but they clearly aren't markedly better than any of the other teams you profiled.  On a particular day, they might win or lose, and for that reason, they should be in Flight1 but aren't for reasons nobody outside of the evaluation committee knows.

It may be cold comfort, but this same thing has happened to numerous other teams the last 2 seasons.  When people are obsessing about scrimmages, pre-season games, and aggregate shots against totals, none of which the CAHA evaluators consider, it's just another example of how this system punishes coaches, parents and players.   

For 3 seasons now I've seen the toll this takes on the psyche of the participants and the disruption it has caused to teams and programs.  Rather than focusing on development, training and end season goals, Tier2 begins with this stressful evaluation which robs everyone of the pre-season tournament that clubs enjoyed for years, and involves stress, injuries and heartbreaking disappointment for many of the participants, literally before the season has even begun.

It's fostered resentment and infighting amongst the various clubs, which only serves to poison the entire community.  It may sound trite to some, but respect for your opponents and valuing them for the competition they provide was stressed to me growing up.  It's a fundamental tenet of the positive coaching alliance among other youth sport organizations. 


At this point, my son has played at one time or another with a lot of kids on different teams and knows even more from hockey camps and clinics he's attended.  The kid you play against this season might be your teammate next year, or someone who becomes a close friend away from the rink.  Yes, the system is poorly implemented, biased and inherently mean spirited and frequently very unfair, but it's actually far worse than that, in terms of what it has been doing to the youth hockey community in California.  For many of my friends, when we talk about CAHA, it's about how our kids can or will escape it either by outgrowing it or playing hockey in some other state.
« Last Edit: September 11, 2019, 09:24:33 PM by lcadad »

JackBender

  • Peewee
  • ***
  • Posts: 188
  • LR Justice +49/-20
    • Tom's Chuckle Barn
Re: What Bantam AA Teams for 2019-2020?
« Reply #87 on: September 11, 2019, 10:31:06 PM »
Yes. Very well stated on an emotional level.  This element gets lost in a lot of the debates. 


I know kids at PW and Bantam who have quit hockey in their major year because their teams didn't make Flight 1.  They quit hockey.  Quit.  I'm pretty sure that is not within the USA Hockey mandate of "expanding the game," and I'm pretty sure they'd be horrified to learn it was a side effect of the flighting system.  Even one kid quitting for something as trivial as that is wrong. 


The system might have been well intentioned, but it stinks.  We'll see if the powers that be do the right thing.
I'm your Huckleberry

Landshark

  • Peewee
  • ***
  • Posts: 238
  • LR Justice +77/-47
Re: What Bantam AA Teams for 2019-2020?
« Reply #88 on: September 12, 2019, 12:21:10 AM »
No.  The OC game kind of took that off the table. 


I know you’re mad. All you can see is injustice. I don’t mind that you select your favorite games but it certainly didn’t help your case if you tied OC.  Unless you have another great comparison that makes that result not representative of your team.
 
« Last Edit: September 12, 2019, 12:23:00 AM by Landshark »

JackBender

  • Peewee
  • ***
  • Posts: 188
  • LR Justice +49/-20
    • Tom's Chuckle Barn
Re: What Bantam AA Teams for 2019-2020?
« Reply #89 on: September 12, 2019, 07:01:57 AM »
Ice Dogs.


And Head-to-Head.


"Wave also beat Bears(2) 4-1 before the weekend. And you don't mention the Ice Dogs win, the #3 team in the State. Bears(2) played the Ice Dogs before the weekend, losing 8-1. Flyers lost to the Ice Dogs 7-3. The Wave beat the Ice Dogs 2-0."
I'm your Huckleberry