Author Topic: Tryouts are pushed agaoin  (Read 15358 times)

JackBender

  • Peewee
  • ***
  • Posts: 186
  • LR Justice +49/-20
    • Tom's Chuckle Barn
Re: Tryouts are pushed agaoin
« Reply #90 on: July 24, 2020, 07:44:43 AM »
Thank you anonymous Internet person on random message board but...


You're trying to predict the future, and the current facts suggest otherwise: AAA teams are forming this weekend or the next around the entire country (if they haven't formed already) to start practicing as teams, the Prep Cup in New Hampshire is happening this weekend, as is the USHL Combine in Green Bay, Wisconsin... and CAHA's official release specifically allows teams to form for the purpose to attend out-of-state tournaments


So, yes, this could be a giant conspiracy by USA Hockey and CAHA and every other sanctioned state hockey body to lock up their players now... so they can shut everything down in September, but the truth likely lies somewhere in-between. This season will certainly be odd and frustrating and different... but things will happen. Teams will find a way.  And the rinks, coaches, clubs and USA Hockey will get their money.


To quote Fist's favorite movie ever, Jurassic Park: "Life will find a way." Or in this case... hockey. 
I'll be your Huckleberry

Rats13

  • Peewee
  • ***
  • Posts: 114
  • LR Justice +16/-2
Re: Tryouts are pushed agaoin
« Reply #91 on: July 24, 2020, 11:53:54 AM »
Thank you anonymous Internet person on random message board but...


You're trying to predict the future, and the current facts suggest otherwise: AAA teams are forming this weekend or the next around the entire country (if they haven't formed already) to start practicing as teams, the Prep Cup in New Hampshire is happening this weekend, as is the USHL Combine in Green Bay, Wisconsin... and CAHA's official release specifically allows teams to form for the purpose to attend out-of-state tournaments


So, yes, this could be a giant conspiracy by USA Hockey and CAHA and every other sanctioned state hockey body to lock up their players now... so they can shut everything down in September, but the truth likely lies somewhere in-between. This season will certainly be odd and frustrating and different... but things will happen. Teams will find a way.  And the rinks, coaches, clubs and USA Hockey will get their money.


To quote Fist's favorite movie ever, Jurassic Park: "Life will find a way." Or in this case... hockey.


Are the kids really locked up?  Sounds like they can drop at any time and actually can't sign a commitment or pay money. Also defining "skating with another club" is hazy at best.  Most skates are with "coaches" so probably don't fall under that.


 

Strawman

  • Peewee
  • ***
  • Posts: 161
  • LR Justice +48/-45
Re: Tryouts are pushed agaoin
« Reply #92 on: July 24, 2020, 12:32:52 PM »
Thank you anonymous Internet person on random message board but...


You're trying to predict the future, and the current facts suggest otherwise: AAA teams are forming this weekend or the next around the entire country (if they haven't formed already) to start practicing as teams, the Prep Cup in New Hampshire is happening this weekend, as is the USHL Combine in Green Bay, Wisconsin... and CAHA's official release specifically allows teams to form for the purpose to attend out-of-state tournaments


So, yes, this could be a giant conspiracy by USA Hockey and CAHA and every other sanctioned state hockey body to lock up their players now... so they can shut everything down in September, but the truth likely lies somewhere in-between. This season will certainly be odd and frustrating and different... but things will happen. Teams will find a way.  And the rinks, coaches, clubs and USA Hockey will get their money.


To quote Fist's favorite movie ever, Jurassic Park: "Life will find a way." Or in this case... hockey.


Are the kids really locked up?  Sounds like they can drop at any time and actually can't sign a commitment or pay money. Also defining "skating with another club" is hazy at best.  Most skates are with "coaches" so probably don't fall under that.


You are correct. CAHA’s announcement specifically says players cannot be committed and clubs can’t charge them fees. Jack can fantasize whatever he wants, but folks should talk to coaches to find out what it all actually means.

Rats13

  • Peewee
  • ***
  • Posts: 114
  • LR Justice +16/-2
Re: Tryouts are pushed agaoin
« Reply #93 on: July 24, 2020, 12:57:34 PM »
Thank you anonymous Internet person on random message board but...


You're trying to predict the future, and the current facts suggest otherwise: AAA teams are forming this weekend or the next around the entire country (if they haven't formed already) to start practicing as teams, the Prep Cup in New Hampshire is happening this weekend, as is the USHL Combine in Green Bay, Wisconsin... and CAHA's official release specifically allows teams to form for the purpose to attend out-of-state tournaments


So, yes, this could be a giant conspiracy by USA Hockey and CAHA and every other sanctioned state hockey body to lock up their players now... so they can shut everything down in September, but the truth likely lies somewhere in-between. This season will certainly be odd and frustrating and different... but things will happen. Teams will find a way.  And the rinks, coaches, clubs and USA Hockey will get their money.


To quote Fist's favorite movie ever, Jurassic Park: "Life will find a way." Or in this case... hockey.


Are the kids really locked up?  Sounds like they can drop at any time and actually can't sign a commitment or pay money. Also defining "skating with another club" is hazy at best.  Most skates are with "coaches" so probably don't fall under that.


You are correct. CAHA’s announcement specifically says players cannot be committed and clubs can’t charge them fees. Jack can fantasize whatever he wants, but folks should talk to coaches to find out what it all actually means.


My first reaction to this was wow kids potentially have more leverage in this situation as well as high potential from drama.  :o

alfirst

  • Peewee
  • ***
  • Posts: 124
  • LR Justice +16/-27
Re: Tryouts are pushed agaoin
« Reply #94 on: July 24, 2020, 01:06:23 PM »
I still do not get it - how we used to participate in off-season out-of-state tournaments all prior years and can't do it now.
We have not used official club name - something similar - but still played.   
And Memorial Day  - Carmen Star - was also prior tryouts - and there teams were wearing club uniforms.
Something has changed? 

notTHATdad

  • Squirt
  • **
  • Posts: 87
  • LR Justice +39/-4
Re: Tryouts are pushed agaoin
« Reply #95 on: July 24, 2020, 03:43:04 PM »
I still do not get it - how we used to participate in off-season out-of-state tournaments all prior years and can't do it now.
We have not used official club name - something similar - but still played.   
And Memorial Day  - Carmen Star - was also prior tryouts - and there teams were wearing club uniforms.
Something has changed?


Could be they were using a 'tournament roster', which is a special purpose roster for a tournament. Still has to go through CAHA/USAHockey. Kids still have to be registered with USAHockey. I don't remember what all the rules were for that from my team manager days.










fistocuffs

  • Squirt
  • **
  • Posts: 76
  • LR Justice +28/-45
Re: Tryouts are pushed agaoin
« Reply #96 on: July 24, 2020, 05:37:20 PM »
You are correct in tourney rosters   I think main difference is Covid and state currently saying no bueno to youth team indoor contact sports


Caha most likely wants to make it extremely obvious that as a California non profit that represents the state for most all ammetaur youth  indoor contact team sport. That it stands on the correct side of the state heath guidelines at all times


I do not know much about law. But I am pretty sure that any and all waivers do not apply to indirect parties.   Say. You form a team and take it to Reno.  You all sign waivers. You all feel protected.  But your opponents team managers husband did not and was not at event.   14 days later he lands on a ventilator


Now the fun begins.   The last thing any group like caha wants to hear is that they approved rosters and supported team play. Even though state manadate says no team sports allowed for youth in ca


It’s all fun and games until someone dies. Then then people like to place blame.


The rule is simple.  Ca say no indoor contact team sports allowed in ca.   You can ask anyone in government health org. Doctors.  Practictioners.  They will all say it’s clear


What makes it hard is when you try to find ways around it and think it’s all going to be good for everyone.    It may in fact be ok in the end.  But it’s that one time when it’s not that really gives all parties to the fact. A sever dose of reality


Most rational people would say. Waiting 90 days is not going to kill anyone


Not waiting just may kill a few





Stick Tap

  • Mite
  • *
  • Posts: 10
  • LR Justice +29/-26
Re: Tryouts are pushed agaoin
« Reply #97 on: July 24, 2020, 07:37:53 PM »


Most rational people would say. Waiting 90 days is not going to kill anyone


Not waiting just may kill a few


Oh stop it. 9 million kids 18 years or younger in the state of California and NOT 1 has died of Covid! Influenza is much deadlier for kids and no one thinks twice about stepping into the rink in the heart of flu season. Kids are fine. Let them play. Let them go to school. 2 weeks to slow the curve has been 5 months. But sure, let's tack on 3 more months. It's just their CHILDHOOD! All good, they'll be young forever.
« Last Edit: July 24, 2020, 07:39:22 PM by Stick Tap »

alfirst

  • Peewee
  • ***
  • Posts: 124
  • LR Justice +16/-27
Re: Tryouts are pushed agaoin
« Reply #98 on: July 24, 2020, 10:47:10 PM »
Fist just wasn't at the rinks of late - there are tons of kids skating (of all ages and levels) and some of them putting serious hours there.
It's all called "day camps"  - but does not differ from practices and clinics too much.
So "indirect parties" have been affected for some time. Indirect parties can also get hurt in a variety of ways - die in a car crash while driving to/from the rink, get assaulted by peaceful protesters while hanging out in big cities for tournaments etc etc.
And I think there was some legal ruling disallowing COVID related lawsuits.

However I guess that discussion is endless and unproductive- as nobody will prove anything to anybody.

I wonder, why even bother on forums for those who decided to sit it out...

« Last Edit: July 25, 2020, 08:45:47 AM by alfirst »

Strawman

  • Peewee
  • ***
  • Posts: 161
  • LR Justice +48/-45
Re: Tryouts are pushed agaoin
« Reply #99 on: July 25, 2020, 12:03:34 AM »


Most rational people would say. Waiting 90 days is not going to kill anyone


Not waiting just may kill a few


Oh stop it. 9 million kids 18 years or younger in the state of California and NOT 1 has died of Covid! Influenza is much deadlier for kids and no one thinks twice about stepping into the rink in the heart of flu season. Kids are fine. Let them play. Let them go to school. 2 weeks to slow the curve has been 5 months. But sure, let's tack on 3 more months. It's just their CHILDHOOD! All good, they'll be young forever.


Lightning strikes are statistically a more serious risk for people under 20 than Covid.  California must cancel weather next.

fistocuffs

  • Squirt
  • **
  • Posts: 76
  • LR Justice +28/-45
Re: Tryouts are pushed agaoin
« Reply #100 on: July 27, 2020, 08:27:25 AM »
okay.. this is getting like religion.   I am trying to be as clear as possible.  Its NOT THE KIDS that will be impacted.    KIDS become carriers and spread it to people unknowingly.  I am worried about who gets indirectly infected.   Its called transmission by a carrier.  The Kid is the carrier, the the one who most likely will die.    This is exactly what CDC and state is worried about.




fistocuffs

  • Squirt
  • **
  • Posts: 76
  • LR Justice +28/-45
Re: Tryouts are pushed agaoin
« Reply #101 on: July 27, 2020, 08:49:54 AM »


Most rational people would say. Waiting 90 days is not going to kill anyone


Not waiting just may kill a few


Oh stop it. 9 million kids 18 years or younger in the state of California and NOT 1 has died of Covid! Influenza is much deadlier for kids and no one thinks twice about stepping into the rink in the heart of flu season. Kids are fine. Let them play. Let them go to school. 2 weeks to slow the curve has been 5 months. But sure, let's tack on 3 more months. It's just their CHILDHOOD! All good, they'll be young forever.


Since flu kills 60k 100k over a 12 month period, with no quarantining in place - and allowed to run rampant and unchecked - and no hospital contained at 100% no shortage of ventilators, etc
COVID - on track to kill 200k people in 9 months - massive lockdowns in place - economy shuttered, hospitals in hotspots overrun - ICU's full capacity.. 
I can only imagine what COVID would do if we simply treated it like the flu.


ok.  Lets try to explain it this way. 


Person:


"I drove my car through a mall and hit no one - therefore its safe to drive car through mall"


Police:


"Ah, you drove your car through the mall when no-one was there at 3:00 am. So there was no one to hurt, still you should really not be doing this in general"


Person:
"I don't get it, if I drive my car through the mall and hit no one - its safe to drive through mall - no one will get hurt, right?.  I was fine for sure - as you can see I am alive - so no one will get killed."


Police:
"Ah... well, if people are in the mall at the time - Odds are that you will hit someone - since there will be people there at the time, and you no doubt will injure a few and most likely kill a few.  You being in a car and all.  Will most likely be ok."


Person:
"That makes no sense and is dumb - I Already drove through mall - and no one got hurt - its as safe as driving down the road. (aka flu) - you guys just don't want me to drive through the mall - you are infringing on my right to drive.  "


Police:  "Yikers... ok.  You cannot compare like that.  When no one is in the mall - there is no one there to hit - so it appears safe, but if you do this when its open and 10k people are milling about - you will kill a-lot of people... do you understand this?"


Person:  "I don't.  I am fine, I drove the the mall and did not die. No problem at all - in fact it was safe.  I know this because I was fine and no one got killed.  So if I don't die, no one else will.  All drivers that drive through malls will be just fine,  no driver has died.  Why are you so worried.."


Police:   arrgggh.   I really do not know what to say at this point.  You will be fine, you are in a car, you can cause quite a bit of damage most likely, but you as the driver will be fine.    Are you saying that since you are fine and all other drivers that attempt such a trick will be fine - because you already did this at 3:00 am - when mall was empty???"


Person: Exactly - you have proven my point.  No one will get hurt - everyone will be fine. 


Police:  Who is everyone?  in your mind?


person:  Well.  Me and the other drivers of course


Police:  What about all the people walking around in the mall???


Person: What about them?


Insert (time to go fishing and relax)




Police:   What about all the other people that may be in the mall when you attempt to drive through it.. say on a nice weekend afternoon???


Person:  Huh?  I am not worried about them at all.  I jus want to drive through a mall/


Police:


Stick Tap

  • Mite
  • *
  • Posts: 10
  • LR Justice +29/-26
Re: Tryouts are pushed agaoin
« Reply #102 on: July 27, 2020, 09:29:57 AM »
okay.. this is getting like religion.   I am trying to be as clear as possible.  Its NOT THE KIDS that will be impacted.    KIDS become carriers and spread it to people unknowingly.  I am worried about who gets indirectly infected.   Its called transmission by a carrier.  The Kid is the carrier, the the one who most likely will die.    This is exactly what CDC and state is worried about.


Quit spreading bullshit. There have been countless studies done thus far that show kids do not possess a large enough viral load to be spreaders. I could link to many articles, but here's one for now that took 2 seconds to find.


https://www.usnews.com/news/world/articles/2020-07-13/german-study-shows-low-coronavirus-infection-rate-in-schools




""Children may even act as a brake on infection," Berner told a news conference, saying infections in schools had not led to an outbreak, while the spread of the virus within households was also less dynamic than previously thought.


Oh wait, here's another...


https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2020/07/20/892354171/kids-get-coronavirus-but-do-they-spread-it-well-find-out-when-schools-reopen


"[/size]"Kids don't [/size]seem[/size] to be super spreaders," says [/size]Dr. Aaron Carroll[/size], a pediatrician at Indiana University School of Medicine. "


And another...


https://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/early/2020/07/08/peds.2020-1576


Oh, one more just for fun!


http://ncirs.org.au/sites/default/files/2020-04/NCIRS%20NSW%20Schools%20COVID_Summary_FINAL%20public_26%20April%202020.pdf


Do your own research. If you are still afraid, stay home until there is a vaccine. And in the meantime, let those who are fine with the "risk" (in quotes because there isn't any actual risk!) do our thing.








Hamacher Checking Camp

  • Peewee
  • ***
  • Posts: 127
  • LR Justice +40/-8
Re: Tryouts are pushed agaoin
« Reply #103 on: July 27, 2020, 09:42:41 AM »
Get out of bed - risk
step in to slippery shower - medium risk
eat quick and processed food - longer term risk
get in the car and drive - high risk
take stairs or elevator - risk
being inside a heavy building in earthquake territory - risk
open mouth at work or communicate in written word - risk
nibble on lunch room community food - risk
use your "clean cup" that sits on your desk - risk
drive again - high risk
do some manual labor at home - risk
drive kid to sports, rink, activity - high risk
pick up fast food on way home - longer term risk

At any point freedom allows us to pick and choose which of these we do or don't do and how each affects ourselves and all those around us.  Millions refuse to drive or fly and we don't hear about it.  SO PLEASE feel free to exercise your freedom of choice BUT do not attempt to transfer your perceived or real risk on to others.  Some things in life are worth "sitting out".  Now is your chance to do just that and do it quietly........

As for me and my house, we have weighed the risk of Covid and determined the mental health of us and our own offspring, as it relates to the 2nd and 3rd and 4th order consequences of trying to avoid "risk", is indeed orders of magnitude riskier by staying in the bubble. 










KickSave

  • Squirt
  • **
  • Posts: 89
  • LR Justice +18/-18
Re: Tryouts are pushed agaoin
« Reply #104 on: July 27, 2020, 10:07:19 AM »
The number of epidemiologists and public health experts on here is truly impressive.
Wear a mask. Wash your hands. Don’t be a jerk. It’s easy stuff, but as long as we have people out doing their own thing, schools and hockey will be shut down for our kids.